more re: The myth of over-population


Richard Moore

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The myth of over-population:

re: The myth of over-population:


From: Ray Songtree
Date: 4 December 2009 06:08:07 GMT
Subject: Re: The myth of over-population

I read all your comments. as usual you are right on. You are right, all these activisms within the present system are just distractions. I get it.
I agree, cleaning up our act is our task, period. And the only way to do that IMO is to unseat those in power, who should be brought down because their values are entrenched in a caste system.
My thesis is that the fake pandemic was orchestrated to produce martial law, because the unemployed have to be silenced. My thesis is that if there is not enough evidence to justify martial law, that is, not enough panic, then the vaccination agenda will fail, and the asses of the elites will be exposed to the angry mobs who will take down the FED to start,and then disclosure will be demandedon everything.
If it doesn’t go this way, and martial law comes about, we are going to have a hard time. That is why I think that exposing the fake pandemic is crucial to derailing the Machine, which will fall from its own lies, if martial law can’t be deployed. For me H1N1 is spelled “martial law”.
I love your writing. I let it influence me because you speakplain truth and I instantly adjust my thinking.

thanks for including my effort in your posts

Hi Ray,
Unfortunately, there is another card that can yet be played: a virulent deadly pathogen can be introduced (aerial spraying or whatever) into a major US city, of the kind that struck a limited area in the Ukraine.  This would be followed by an Obama speech, where he says that for our own safety we can no longer pussy-foot around with the vaccine program, and they must now be mandatory. If that card is played, then any widespread resistance to taking the vaccine will become a justification for marital law. Even our legitimate resistance has been incorporated into their psy-ops strategy.
I invite you to reconsider placing your hopes in “angry mobs taking down the Fed”. First of all, given our experience since Seattle with major demonstrations, we can expect brutal suppression of any angry mobs, enhanced now with military troops and the recent declaration of a National Emergency. Second, what outcomes could we expect if angry mobs did succeed in destabilizing the regime? When angry mobs stormed the Bastille, the outcome was a Reign of Terror, and the guillotine. I don’t see angry mobs as being a vehicle likely to create a better society.
From: “M.A. Omas Schaefer”
Date: 4 December 2009 06:42:36 GMT
To: “Richard Moore” <•••@••.•••>
Subject: Re: The myth of over-population

It is almost humorous to see the arguments that some of your readers make based on false premises. I say “almost” because it is kind of sad to see how otherwise intelligent people have been hoodwinked.

Hi Omas,
By the time we finish high school, all of us, intelligent or otherwise, have been hoodwinked with everything from Santa Claus to religious dogma to the glorious history of competition and the American Dream. Waking up is a process of gradually peeling away the countless onion layers of hoodwink. Rather than bemoaning the remaining hoodwink, we need to give ourselves credit for the progress we’ve made.
It is not the case that some of us ‘know’ and others are ‘hoodwinked’. It is only that we are at different places on the path to awakening. On this list we compare notes and gradually help one another move forward. Those who are willing to express their unexamined assumptions do us all a service.

Date: 4 December 2009 09:02:30 GMT
To: “‘Richard Moore'” <•••@••.•••>
Subject: RE: The myth of over-population


I find this dialogue both astonishing and disturbing. Bill Blum suggests that removing 50 million cars from US highways would be hugely beneficial. He is correct. Of course he is, but his means of achieving it. Wow! There again maybe he is bang on with his solution. I am not being racisthere, but if we were first to concentrate all energies on the United States of America for their proposed massive population decrease – beginning with Wall St, the Eastern Establishment, and Washington – I am confident the starving of Africa would sleep easier, the world would be a much safer and better place, and the rest of us could begin to clear up the debris and get on with our little lives in peace and reasonable prosperity. 
All I can say is thank God for the Richard Moore’s and Bill Ellis’s of this world. Although everything points to it, and you have been hammering the message home for many years now, Richard, some appear either unwilling or unable to grasp that the the underlying problem is rooted in the fact that a small clique of self-serving fascist elites have, for many long years, been ruling the world for their own ends and to the severe detriment of the planet and the vast majority living on it. Unless people wake up to that fact and act, we are all whistling in the wind and, as you rightly say, contributing to their genocidal agenda.
Warm best wishes,
Jim Macgregor.

Hi Jim,
Yes, the reality of the ‘small self-serving ruling clique’ is the single most important ‘truth’ of today’s human condition. Unfortunately this truth is covered by some very stubborn layers of the onion: beliefs in ‘social progress’ and ‘democracy’. These hoodwinks are very deeply engrained, by the history we are taught in school and by daily propaganda of all kinds. People are afraid to question this faith – their whole world falls apart – just as a religious believer would be afraid to question the existence of ‘God’. They point to the Erin Brockovich story as proof the ‘system works’, when in fact it’s a story of how the system doesn’t work. One finger, in one hole in the dike, does not stop a flood.
While people have an unshakable faith in progress and democracy, they also, quite ironically, have a sense of helplessness, that changing the system is impossible – Since the system can’t be changed, the only way to save the Earth is to get rid of people


From: “laurence” 
Date: 4 December 2009 10:12:51 GMT
To: “Richard Moore” <•••@••.•••>
Subject: Re: re: The myth of over-population

 As I read other readers comments, I am apalled to realise how deeply cultural conditioning goes. I live in France, here average folks do not want always more, no, their priority is quality of life, a large percentage of french are aware of how destructive a consumption culture is, they are not identified with their level of consumption, the same applies to swiss people.
However I have sadly noticed that most americans are convinced that the whole world envy and want to copy their life style! Americans do identify with high levels of consumption, their imprint is huge and they will suffer when they’ll have to curb their expenses.
A huge part of western propaganda has been rooted in cultural discrimination and the demise of traditional cultures, cultural humiliation…A person who see one’s culture as an ideal others ought to envy are not ready for change, it is logic that they see anyone else as a threat, given their claim on global resources.

Hi Laurence,
Isn’t it amazing how those with the most power always feel they are under threat. In the case of America I think it has something to do with an imperialist mindset: resistance to US dominance anywhere in the world is seen as an attack on America. It’s really kind of obscene, how Americans see themselves as being ‘special’. They can unleash holocausts on the people of Iraq and Afghanistan, killing millions of civilians, and it’s ‘spreading democracy’ and ‘worth the price’ – but a few people get killed somewhere in America and its a ‘horrendous event’. A bit like with Israel and the Palestinians, but on a global scale.
From: Thomas Schley
Date: 5 December 2009 01:59:16 GMT
Subject: The Myths that Blind Us

Richard, below are some quotes from a new work, “The Vegetarian Myth” by Lierre Keith.  Keith is a farmer, writer, and radical feminist activist who lives in California and New England.  Her book is a call for us to wake up and change the myths that are leading us to destruction of ourselves and the earth.  I don’t necessarily agree with all she says, but she is right on about what we have to do to change this.  Richard, in this I believe she is near to what you have been telling us all these years.  Except for marching against the Viet Nam War, and sending the President telegrams protesting nuclear testing (both decades ago when I perhaps had more personal courage and energy) I’ve mostly relied on personal change and choice to “change the world”, a method that Keith (and I believe you too) points out as hopelessly ineffective.  

Cheers, Tom

     The related dead end of individualism is the extreme personal purity of the “lifestyle activists.”  Understand: the task of an activist is not to negotiate systems of power with as much personal integrity as possible – it’s to dismantle those systems.  Neither of these approaches – personal psychological change or personal lifestyle choices – is going to disrupt the global arrangements of power.  They’re both ultimately liberal approaches to injustice, rerouting the goal from political change to personal change.  This is easier, much easier, because it makes no demands on us.  It requires no courage or sacrifice, no persistenc or honor, which is what direct confrontations  with power  must require.  But personal purity only asks for shopping and smugness.  The mainstream version involves hybrid cars, soy milk, soy burgers, and soy babies, and checking off the “green power” option on your electric bill.  On the very fringe, there is a more extreme version which offers semi-nomadic life…  To point out the obvious: power doesn’t care.  Power doesn’t notice…if they (the fringe) eat out of dumpsters.  Power will only care when you build a strategic movement against it  Individual will never be effective.  To quote Andrea Dworkin, we need organized, political resistance.”

Hi Tom,
Many thanks for telling us about Lierre Keith. A rare voice of common sense radicalism. Her book can be ordered from the website above, and several chapters are online. I wrote a note to Lierre, and was very pleased to get a response, and that exchange comes next.
From: Richard Moore <•••@••.•••>
Date: 5 December 2009 09:52:19 GMT
To: Lierre Keith 
Subject: Thanks for making sense!

Hi Lierre,

You wrote:

Power will only care when you build a strategic movement against it  Individual will never be effective.  To quote Andrea Dworkin, we need organized, political resistance.

I am amazed at how few people (in the global north) understand this fundamental truth. Liberalism is the opiate of the intelligentsia. 

In my most recent posting, I wrote:
If you think changing the political system is impossible, then you might as well forget about politics and causes and just enjoy yourself while you can. And as long as all the activists are wasting their time with other things, changing the political system will be impossible. If we all redirected our activist energies to dealing with the REAL PROBLEM, we would be able to create solutions together.

The problem for you and me, of course, is: what is the nature of the ‘strategic movement’? This is the problem I’ve been working on for the past ten years. We need to keep in mind that there have been successful revolutions in history, and they have never fixed things. Our strategic movement needs to be as much about creating the system we want, as it is about resistance: the means always become the ends

I’ve written my conclusions in a book, Escaping the Matrix: how we the people can change the world. And I’ve summarized the ideas online:

warm regards,



From: L Keith 
Date: 5 December 2009 22:33:19 GMT
To: Richard Moore <•••@••.•••>
Subject: Re: Thanks for making sense!

Hi Richard,

Thanks for writing!

You wrote:
I am amazed at how few people (in the global north) understand this fundamental truth. Liberalism is the opiate of the intelligentsia. 

Oh, that last line is wonderful. Make sure you put it in your book!

Our strategic movement needs to be as much about creating the system we want, as it is about resistance: the means always become the ends. 

The book I’m writing right now (Deep Green Resistance, with Derrick Jensen and Aric Mcbay) is about exactly that. I’d say we need a resistance movement to take down industrial infrastructure, and simultaneously, a culture of resistance to create the new society–direct democracy, democratically controlled economies, and a mythic matrix that keeps human hubris in check.

I’ve written my conclusions in a book, Escaping the Matrix …

This looks wonderful–thanks for all your work in the world.

Best, Lierre

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